Author Topic: The decline of digital?  (Read 1998 times)

lharby

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Late Developer

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #1 on: April 05, 2017, 04:32:27 PM »
Interesting.

I suspect that what we're seeing is a plateau effect - much in the same way as we did when film cameras did with the likes of the Nikon F5, EOS 1n, etc.  It's a sort of "where do we go from here?", conundrum.  Technology's life blood is innovation and, now that digital technology is getting to a level where incremental improvements become increasingly difficult, releasing a new model that's 95% the same as its predecessor (and £5,000+ body only) is it any real surprise when it doesn't fly off the shelves?

When the current resurgence of film usage started, I was worried that it was a bit of a "dead cat bounce" that would be superseded by the next iteration of digital wizardry.  The main concern I have (if you can call it a concern) is the emergence of larger than full-frame sensors.  I've seen the output from the latest Hasselblad and Fuji kit and, if you want absolute technical perfection, they have a lot to offer.  However, it's at a high price (just now).  I'd still have my Hasselblad 503cx but I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't consider a Phase One back (when they get a price I can afford) to complement the A12s I have.

Markets go through cycles and I don't think we can write off digital.  What we need to do is keep using lots of film and ensure that the likes of Ilford, Fuji and Kodak (+ new / returning kids on the block) see that there's enough demand to keep manufacturing and supplying us.  I'm not a big Adam Smith fan but his argument that:

"Consumption is the sole end and purpose of all production; and the interest of the producer ought to be attended to, only so far as it may be necessary for promoting that of the consumer."

resonates with me.  They aren't charities and there's no sentiment in business these days.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2017, 04:34:28 PM by Late Developer »
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Bryan

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2017, 08:36:39 PM »
It was a nice try, now everyone can get back to film.

Francois

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2017, 09:20:48 PM »
I think the digital thing has reached a point where it becomes somewhat ridicule. I just saw this morning that Sony plans on releasing a 150mpx camera this year... and all I keep wondering since reading this is "what the heck would I need such resolution for?" It's not like there's any need to print billboard size images at 300 DPI !
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jharr

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2017, 09:26:42 PM »
I just saw this morning that Sony plans on releasing a 150mpx camera this year...
Also known as a medium resolution scan of 4x5 film. :)
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John Robison

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2017, 07:22:54 AM »
It was a nice try, now everyone can get back to film.
Nope, don't want everyone going back to film. I like being able to buy top quality mid 70's SLR's for 2 or 3 cents on the dollar. I've bought entry level cameras, such as the Ricoh KR5 with the standard 50mm f2 lens, working perfectly, for $5, and that included good meter batteries. Last summer, at a photo show there were several OM-1 md bodies, you pick, for $12 each. Of the two or three I picked up, they were functional although I couldn't check the meters. Sure, stuff is getting old, but I love the pricing.

lharby

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2017, 10:05:35 AM »
I don't think that will ever change John, or change ever so slightly.
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chris667

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2017, 12:55:27 PM »
One of the main things that has put me off digital cameras so far is the amount of spurious functionality. At the photography club I go to sometimes, there is great pride in photos taken with "creative filters" and the like. They are almost always dull.

My partner makes jewellery, and I bought her a DSLR for gallery photographs and the like. It's very capable, but to do something as simple as previewing the depth of field, you have to go through about three menus. It's ridiculous that such a basic feature is hidden.

If one of the mainstream manufacturers ever brings out a digital camera like some of the Leica digital rangefinders for a few hundred pounds rather than a few thousand, I might be interested. The price of a Leica is just too much for me to justify.

My club has a compare our cameras night next week. It will be interesting to try out the new cameras, but I'll 1be bringing my Spotmatic.

Francois

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2017, 02:22:35 PM »
I can just imagine the following
What's the frame rate on that thing?
The speed of your thumb.  ;D
Francois

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Bryan

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2017, 05:25:09 PM »
My partner makes jewellery, and I bought her a DSLR for gallery photographs and the like. It's very capable, but to do something as simple as previewing the depth of field, you have to go through about three menus. It's ridiculous that such a basic feature is hidden.

If one of the mainstream manufacturers ever brings out a digital camera like some of the Leica digital rangefinders for a few hundred pounds rather than a few thousand, I might be interested. The price of a Leica is just too much for me to justify.

I totally agree with you on this point.  I had the whole family over and wanted to take a group shot.  It took me less time to set up my Polaroid land camera with a self timer and take the shot than it did for me to find the self timer function on my Olympus OM-D.  I hate searching thru menus, that's why I got the OM-D, it has most functions similar to a film SLR but it's not perfect.  I'm sure if I used it more I would learn how to use the functions better but I mostly just use it to scan film. 

02Pilot

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2017, 06:14:07 PM »
The closest affordable thing to a proper (i.e. film) rangefinder that I've found is the Fuji X-E1 (and 2 and 2S presumably, and the X-Pro1 & 2, and probably the fixed-lens X100-series as well). No, it's not perfect, but it's got a shutter speed dial on top, and used with adapted manual lenses, it works pretty much like a manual focus film camera in normal use. Pretty solid, metal chassis - hell, it even has a threaded shutter button for using a manual cable release. Do wish it was full-frame, though.

With that heretical statement made, I think the digital camera market is being hit by the diminishing returns of Moore's Law, much as the PC market and to some extent the phone/tablet markets have been. Virtually all the needs of the vast majority of users have been met by existing available technology; there's simply nowhere for digital photographic technology to go right now that buyers are willing to follow. When viable 3D cameras and means of projecting the images (still or moving) are developed at the consumer level, I think you'll see the next big burst of purchasing.
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hidaniel

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2017, 06:51:02 PM »
I think the whole issue is not about the death of digital photography but much more so an indictment of the complacency of Canon and Nikon with their marginal incremental improvements and 5 new models coming out every year. I think this blog post: https://photographylife.com/a-few-thoughts-about-the-camera-market/ gives a better picture. Digital interchangable lens cameras are still selling, while supposedly in their death throes, at a rate of 3 times higher than the best years of film interchangable lens cameras. Point and shoot is dead and DSLRs are simple and cheap enough that even your grandparents probably have one.

gsgary

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2017, 06:53:34 PM »
My partner makes jewellery, and I bought her a DSLR for gallery photographs and the like. It's very capable, but to do something as simple as previewing the depth of field, you have to go through about three menus. It's ridiculous that such a basic feature is hidden.

If one of the mainstream manufacturers ever brings out a digital camera like some of the Leica digital rangefinders for a few hundred pounds rather than a few thousand, I might be interested. The price of a Leica is just too much for me to justify.

I totally agree with you on this point.  I had the whole family over and wanted to take a group shot.  It took me less time to set up my Polaroid land camera with a self timer and take the shot than it did for me to find the self timer function on my Olympus OM-D.  I hate searching thru menus, that's why I got the OM-D, it has most functions similar to a film SLR but it's not perfect.  I'm sure if I used it more I would learn how to use the functions better but I mostly just use it to scan film.
Epson RD1 is still very capable and brilliant at B+W you also have to cock the shutter

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« Last Edit: April 06, 2017, 09:54:54 PM by gsgary »

charles binns

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2017, 08:01:05 PM »
Fuji X100T. Best camera ever made.  After the Holga. 

tkmedia

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2017, 05:33:18 AM »
I can just imagine the following
What's the frame rate on that thing?
The speed of your thumb.  ;D

it has a nice quick 45 degree swinging film advance crank! 8)
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chris667

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Re: The decline of digital?
« Reply #15 on: April 10, 2017, 07:36:16 AM »
I had a brilliant time in the woods with my friend and her ten year old daughter yesterday. I was explaining to her how SLRs work, how film worked, and then I sent her off with my Spotmatic.

She got it after about ten minutes, and thought my camera was the best thing ever.

I think I might have started a Filmwaster.