Topic: Kickstarter alert - Lab Box daylight-loading film tank

[thatguychad]

Heads up, ars-imago just launched their Kickstarter campaign for their Lab Box. This is a daylight-loading film development tank akin to the Rondinax, but with multi-format in mind. They have 135 and 120 modules and an expanding reel to accommodate each of those formats.

Disclaimer: I'm not affiliated with the project, I had just been interested in a Rondinax, but they're difficult to find and at least as expensive as the 2-module option for a Lab Box for only a single format.

[Indofunk]

*Peter will not use this because it involves loading 135 film directly from the film canister

[Bryan]

It looks interesting but I can't justify the cost since I already have a full compliment of stainless steel reels that work perfectly fine.  I would also be hesitant to get one until I hear a few reviews of the final product, it just seems like it could have problems, especially with 120 film. 

[thatguychad]

I'm glad I pledged early, the first 200 for the 120 and 135 modules went within about 20 minutes and the project was fully-funded within two hours!

[Adam Doe]

I must admit that I am a sucker for a film photography related Kickstarter or Indie-go-go campaign. I usually find myself backing them, but I stopped short with this one. My Paterson tanks work just fine and I can develop multiple reels at once, which is an important feature for me. I do wish them luck with this campaign though.

[thatguychad]

My Patersons work well, too, but working in a changing bag isn't my favorite thing. Until my darkroom is complete, I'd prefer to use something like this. There are many times where I'll only shoot a single roll in a weekend, so this will work great for my use case.

[John Robison]

Been developing film for almost 50 years. Grab my tanks and film, step into the laundry room, close the door. No use paying over $100 to not step into the laundry room and close the door. Of course, if I was just starting out and didn't have any equipment at all, then this could be interesting.

[Francois]

Funny people think this is a new thing when in fact it's not quite so new.
I know Lomo did make a similar tank (I've seen one). I think Premier did too and wouldn't be surprised if Kodak also did.

[thatguychad]

This idea dates back to the 1930s. Rondinax is probably what you're thinking of and those haven't been made since the 1970s.

Patent history here.

[Francois]

Yeah, there's also that one.

The only real diff between the kickstarter and the others is the multi format part.

[thatguychad]

There are other changes and improvements, and if they driver on their "future developments", there could be some major differences.

[jharr]

Been developing film for almost 50 years. Grab my tanks and film, step into the laundry room, close the door. No use paying over $100 to not step into the laundry room and close the door. Of course, if I was just starting out and didn't have any equipment at all, then this could be interesting.

I'm with you John. Being the cheapest skinflint I know, I can't imagine paying that much for a box of darkness when I can have a whole bathroom full of it for free!

[charles binns]

A lot of money to spend on being able to process one roll at a time. 

[charles binns]

Yeah, there's also that one.

The only real diff between the kickstarter and the others is the multi format part.

A Patterson tank is truly multiformat - this gizmo can only process 135 and 120 film.  what about 5x4 or 127 film?

[Late Developer]

Agfa used to have 135 and 120 versions (separately) and I used my friend's a few times.  I really liked it as it meant I could make a cup of tea and enjoy it, in daylight, whilst processing film.  The option to have 120 and 135 modules, and be able to use the same tank, sounds like a good idea to me and I suspect that I'll end up getting a set of these. 

[Adam Doe]

I can imagine somebody who has never developed their own negatives seeing this and thinking it may be a good way to start. Maybe it's the gateway drug of film processing.

[Sandeha Lynch]

Aye, it may be, and no doubt good as a teaching tool, but I can pick up a Jobo tank and a changing bag for half the outlay of the full set.

Plus, extra spools?  You can't dry a plastic spool with a hairdryer (they melt easily) and you don't always want to wait until the next day to do roll number 2.

Neat idea, though, and I'm sure they'll do well.

[Francois]

The reel on these daylight loading tanks works more like stainless reels than the Paterson ones.
From what I can see, they have a clip on a piece of flexible plastic tied to the center of the reel. The opening where you slip the leader through is slightly narrower than the film to force it into a cup, this makes it slip easily between the ridges of the reel so it can reach the center without binding. Then, as you keep turning the knob, the film settles in the grooves  correctly.

[Sandeha Lynch]

Let's hope they do work as well as stainless.

[Francois]

That, I don't know since you can't feel your way around the reel. But I know they do work. The only thing I wonder about is how it will work with ripped sprockets?

[Bryan]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark. 

[jharr]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark.

And it looks like you have to tear off the backing paper, so no more respooling for 620!

[thatguychad]

And it looks like you have to tear off the backing paper, so no more respooling for 620!

I don't believe it's *required* to tear it, but it's easier for demonstration purposes since you don't have to feed the paper you've pulled through the slot to load it, all the way back through the slot. If you watch the video, it appears that you could skip the tearing if you really wanted to, but you must pull it through the slot in order to feed it into the light-tight chamber.

edit: I've confirmed that I was correct, it's not absolutely necessary to tear the backing paper, but it makes the process a little less cumbersome. I do save my backing paper, but I haven't actually ever re-used it.

[thatguychad]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark.

When you pull the backing paper through the slot, it feeds the film into a lightproof chamber that you close (similar to a bulk loader film gate) when the film is fully loaded. You then pull the lid off, remove the backing paper from the film, and clip the leader onto the end of the film. Re-install the lid, open the light trap, then feed your film onto the reel.

Here's the 120 process in action (video should start at 1:26).

[Bryan]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark.

When you pull the backing paper through the slot, it feeds the film into a lightproof chamber that you close (similar to a bulk loader film gate) when the film is fully loaded. You then pull the lid off, remove the backing paper from the film, and clip the leader onto the end of the film. Re-install the lid, open the light trap, then feed your film onto the reel.

Here's the 120 process in action (video should start at 1:26).

Ok, now I get it. 

[jojonas~]

if they solve heating for c-41 an e-6 then I'll be intrigued!

[Francois]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark.

You simply have to do it like when you use a clamshell on a C-41 machine.
You hold the roll tight in your hand and slowly pull the backing paper until you see a bit of the film stick through. While holding it like that you put the clamshell around the film and close it. Then all you have to do is stick it to the card and feed it in the machine.... Similar thing with this tank.

[Pete_R]

Here's the 120 process in action (video should start at 1:26).

Did you notice how the film got kinked at 02:00 - ugh! Think I'll give it a miss.

[jharr]

I don't see how you get the 120 film started without doing it in the dark.

When you pull the backing paper through the slot, it feeds the film into a lightproof chamber that you close (similar to a bulk loader film gate) when the film is fully loaded. You then pull the lid off, remove the backing paper from the film, and clip the leader onto the end of the film. Re-install the lid, open the light trap, then feed your film onto the reel.

Here's the 120 process in action (video should start at 1:26).

Ok, now I get it.

I still don't buy it. Even with the small amount of film that is sticking out of the light trap at 1:48 you are either hacking off the edge of the first image or at least light piping enough to fog it (seems to me). This would especially be true with something like my Bessa 6x9 where the images get very close to the leading edge.

[Francois]

You do loose a bit more than ¼inch when doing that.
I learned it by looking at the rolls I sent to have processed a few years back. I asked for them to send the film back uncut and was really puzzled by that dark band at the end of all of them...

[Kai-san]

You do loose a bit more than ¼inch when doing that.
I learned it by looking at the rolls I sent to have processed a few years back. I asked for them to send the film back uncut and was really puzzled by that dark band at the end of all of them...

I wouldn't take that chance, some of my cameras put the last frame dangerously close to the edge too. I also noticed that you have to turn a knob to agitate, why do they not put a blinkin' crank on it so you won't have to ruin your wrist?

[thatguychad]

I also noticed that you have to turn a knob to agitate, why do they not put a blinkin' crank on it so you won't have to ruin your wrist?

They did.

[Francois]

For those in a hurry, they could put a drill attachment too